Detroit 2010

Detroit 2010

New postby DetroitLaxfAN on Wed Jul 29, 2009 9:39 am

The first year was not great, but the University is committed to have lacrosse succeed at the school. Moving into a very weak conference next year, (MAAC) I think UDM has a great chance at surprising some people and posting a winning record. They only lose a few people and with the numbers of their latest recruiting classes, they will be in the 40's roster size next year. The Titans are on their way to becoming a force in the Midwest.
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Re: Detroit 2010

New postby nclaxin on Wed Jul 29, 2009 10:00 am

Weak conference huh...

I do not see Detroit beating Canisius, Providence, Mt. St. Mary's, Siena, Manhattan, or VMI or Marist. Maybe St. Joe's and Wagner and possibly one of the before mentioned, but that's it. No knock on Detroit, I am glad they started a team, but it is their 2nd year and the conference is not as "easy" as t seems....
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Re: Detroit 2010

New postby SClaxattack on Wed Jul 29, 2009 10:07 am

DetroitLaxfAN wrote:....the University is committed to have lacrosse succeed at the school. Moving into a very weak conference next year, (MAAC) I think UDM has a great chance at surprising some people and posting a winning record. They only lose a few people and with the numbers of their latest recruiting classes, they will be in the 40's roster size next year. The Titans are on their way to becoming a force in the Midwest.


Welcome to the MAAC, DLF. I wish the Titans success - just not against the Saints.

BTW, be careful of what you post. That prediction might come back to haunt you. All the MAAC posters will forgive you once, but now that you're a member of the Wacky MAAC you're not allowed to publicly dis the conference. :wink: There are enough other people that do that. The MAAC has gotten better over the past decade, good OOC wins, upgrades to facilities, better recruiting, and recently an increase in scholarship availability.
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Re: Detroit 2010

New postby JKLax on Wed Jul 29, 2009 9:25 pm

nclaxin wrote:Weak conference huh...

I do not see Detroit beating Canisius, Providence, Mt. St. Mary's, Siena, Manhattan, or VMI or Marist. Maybe St. Joe's and Wagner and possibly one of the before mentioned, but that's it. No knock on Detroit, I am glad they started a team, but it is their 2nd year and the conference is not as "easy" as t seems....


Wait a minute! St. Joe's beats Canisius, VMI, Marist, Rutgers, and Lehigh, has Mt. St. Mary's beat but loses in the last minute of the game, and takes Providence to 4 OTs, and you put Joe's in Wagner's class, a team Joe's smoked? No way a second year program beats the Hawks, sorry.
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Re: Detroit 2010

New postby OfficerCandidate on Wed Jul 29, 2009 11:28 pm

whoa Detroit Rock City.. Listen you can drop bombs about the Red Wings but do not light up the conference you just joined. You guys were beat by a mid level DII team last year. Please refrain from referring to anything as weak. The MAAC has made tremendous strides in a very short time. More money, better facilities, great coaches being hired. All of these factors can and will give the Titans a means by which to improve and build. Don't knock it until you have tried it. We all would like to see the Titans succeed but let's not put the cart before the horse.
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Re: Detroit 2010

New postby jhu6569 on Thu Jul 30, 2009 12:09 am

Whoa! It seems that the MAAC posting roster is VERY nervous, defensive and, on the other hand, demonstrative and proudly supportive. A poster favoring the incoming newbie Detroit Mercy makes a relatively modest, to me at least, claim that the Detroiters (sorry do not yet know their team nickname) might finish over .500 - and he/she gets pilloried for being underly impressed with the recent strides made by the MAAC.

To me, a lacrosse fan interested in the game itself (not JUST my favored Jays) I think that I will shift some of my attention from leagues like the AE and Patriot to the MAAC this spring. Why? Mainly because I am personally curious as to the veracity of these MAAC messages, AND because I like the apparent feistiness demonstrated by these MAAC posts. IMO, threads like this one only bode GOOD tidings for the future of men's DI lacrosse.

And, please, no one should try to take this post as being either elitist or condescending towards the MAAC. Rather the opposite is the truth. Time, I think has come for many of us overly interested only in National Title possibilities to wake up and realize what IS actually happening in men's DI. To whit - improving conferences like the MAAC, the new Big East, new schools playing in FL, the influx of talented players from non-traditional hotbed regions, etc. WILL change the current calculus of collegiate lacrosse. How much and how quickly? I don't pretend to know. THAT is why I will follow the MAAC more closely next spring. This league could, I think, be a revealing early indicator of change - a bellweather if you follow that antique terminology.

Keep up the repartee please -
"Pro bono humanum"
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Progress...

New postby MadMike on Thu Jul 30, 2009 8:28 am

Detroit will not make it over 0.500 overall this year and may not be able to do it for many years depending on their schedule. However, being in the MAAC and having a fully funded program that is interested in improvements, they very well could get some MAAC wins this year. For the record, I would like to predict that they end up 3-12 in the regular season and 2-6 in the MAAC with wins against Wagner and VMI (other win is presby if they play them).

As the program ages and grows, they may become more competitive and gather more wins. It will take time.

As for the MAAC... Once upon a time the MAAC was the weakest D1 conference. The veritable red-headed-stepchild that every other conference routinely beat up on but, NO MORE! New facilities, more money, different coaching staffs have been added across the board. Competition is heating up with some impressive OOC wins early in last season. The MAAC will only wear the "weakest conference" mantle for one more year (when the NEC gets formed) but will improve this year with more OOC wins and better all around play.
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Re: Detroit 2010

New postby snowbart on Thu Jul 30, 2009 8:49 am

Detroit fans, welcome to the hijack:

MM.

Are you sure the NEC will be weaker than the MAAC? The NEC's top four is Bryant, Robert Morris, Quinnipiac and Sacred Heart (with MSM and Wagner). That's pretty competitive vs. the top 4 in the MAAC when you consider that RM, Q and Sacred Heart all had decent wins this year (SC beat Villanova, Q beat Denver, RM beat PSU and Drexel & Bryant, considered the strongest actually has the weakes best win of the four vs. either Dartmouth or UPenn). MSM had a couple of MAAC wins this year for the second to last place team in the NEC.
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MAAC vs. NEC

New postby MadMike on Thu Jul 30, 2009 9:25 am

snowbart wrote:Are you sure the NEC will be weaker than the MAAC?

The only thing I am SURE of is that my taxes will always increase (unless I get laid off) and that one day, I will no longer be above the ground.

With the formation of the NEC, the MAAC bids goodbye to Wagner and Mount. Both conferences showed some good wins last year (I doubt Bobby Mo would have pulled off the PSU game late in the season). The top 4 teams in each conference match up well and there is no telling how much better/worse the MAAC will be than the NEC.

I just believe the conference average power ranking will be higher for the MAAC.
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Re: Detroit 2010

New postby Munster on Thu Jul 30, 2009 11:35 am

jhu6569 wrote:Whoa! It seems that the MAAC posting roster is VERY nervous, defensive and, on the other hand, demonstrative and proudly supportive. A poster favoring the incoming newbie Detroit Mercy makes a relatively modest, to me at least, claim that the Detroiters (sorry do not yet know their team nickname) might finish over .500 - and he/she gets pilloried for being underly impressed with the recent strides made by the MAAC.

To me, a lacrosse fan interested in the game itself (not JUST my favored Jays) I think that I will shift some of my attention from leagues like the AE and Patriot to the MAAC this spring. Why? Mainly because I am personally curious as to the veracity of these MAAC messages, AND because I like the apparent feistiness demonstrated by these MAAC posts. IMO, threads like this one only bode GOOD tidings for the future of men's DI lacrosse.

And, please, no one should try to take this post as being either elitist or condescending towards the MAAC. Rather the opposite is the truth. Time, I think has come for many of us overly interested only in National Title possibilities to wake up and realize what IS actually happening in men's DI. To whit - improving conferences like the MAAC, the new Big East, new schools playing in FL, the influx of talented players from non-traditional hotbed regions, etc. WILL change the current calculus of collegiate lacrosse. How much and how quickly? I don't pretend to know. THAT is why I will follow the MAAC more closely next spring. This league could, I think, be a revealing early indicator of change - a bellweather if you follow that antique terminology.

Keep up the repartee please -


The nervousness comes from the fact that (from what we hear) Detroit-Mercy is fully funded. Is that true? 12.6? I do not believe any other MAAC team can stake the same claim. A wake-up call to other MAAC schools. Now I realize DM is not Notre Dame, but as I recall it didn't take long for ND to get to the top of the GWLL once the program was fully funded.
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Re: Detroit 2010

New postby Middie90 on Thu Jul 30, 2009 3:29 pm

Munster wrote:
The nervousness comes from the fact that (from what we hear) Detroit-Mercy is fully funded. Is that true? 12.6? I do not believe any other MAAC team can stake the same claim. A wake-up call to other MAAC schools. Now I realize DM is not Notre Dame, but as I recall it didn't take long for ND to get to the top of the GWLL once the program was fully funded.


Yes, UDM is fully funded. I have a friend who is an assistant coach and he said they are already using their 12.6 to "buy" kids that are getting looks from big time schools (i.e. Hopkins, UVA, etc). Is that true? Who knows but you are right, it should be a wake up call for the other schools in the MAAC.

I do know that Lax in Michigan is growing out of control and will only get better. Combine that with Ontario and Ohio and you have some very strong "non traditional" hotbeds that are very close to the Motor City. I'm going to be a huge fan of the Titans in years to come.
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Re: Detroit 2010

New postby pslax6 on Thu Jul 30, 2009 3:52 pm

I would use the money and "buy" a few Canadiens on offense...

They usually turn out alright...

It's a win-win situation for both parties.
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Re: Detroit 2010

New postby detroitfan15 on Fri Jul 31, 2009 9:49 am

Middie90 wrote:
Munster wrote:
The nervousness comes from the fact that (from what we hear) Detroit-Mercy is fully funded. Is that true? 12.6? I do not believe any other MAAC team can stake the same claim. A wake-up call to other MAAC schools. Now I realize DM is not Notre Dame, but as I recall it didn't take long for ND to get to the top of the GWLL once the program was fully funded.


Yes, UDM is fully funded. I have a friend who is an assistant coach and he said they are already using their 12.6 to "buy" kids that are getting looks from big time schools (i.e. Hopkins, UVA, etc). Is that true? Who knows but you are right, it should be a wake up call for the other schools in the MAAC.

I do know that Lax in Michigan is growing out of control and will only get better. Combine that with Ontario and Ohio and you have some very strong "non traditional" hotbeds that are very close to the Motor City. I'm going to be a huge fan of the Titans in years to come.



Thank you, finally someone pointed that out. I don't care what the location, quality of lacrosse, history of program, coaching, etc, if you have a team in a conference with 6-8 more scholarships than the competition, you're going to see W's. Yes, they're a new program, yes they're going to have another losing season next year. But if the rest of the MAAC schools can't keep up with UDM in terms of scholarship dollars, the Titans WILL prevail in this conference.
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Re: Detroit 2010

New postby rocLax22 on Fri Jul 31, 2009 10:02 am

lets not get ahead of ourselves here...Maybe you guys should try to put up one Win before all of this talk of conference championships and winning records. :confusion-shrug:
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Re: Detroit 2010

New postby MadMike on Fri Jul 31, 2009 11:00 am

rocLax22 wrote:lets not get ahead of ourselves here...Maybe you guys should try to put up one Win before all of this talk of conference championships and winning records. :confusion-shrug:

Actually, I'm with him unless the existing members take the "new guy" seriously...

A fully funded program being invited into the MAAC is an indication that the other member institutions are serious about funding their programs and the additional investment needed to keep pace. It will be fun to watch. I think the best thing about this is the additional competition for the blue-chip athletes. Can a start-up program with full funding lure blue-chip athletes away from their typical locales by offering early playing time in addition to $$$? There are probably many talented underclassmen that don't start but could play for anyone. This could be a recruiting tool.
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Re: Detroit 2010

New postby Strannywastheman on Fri Jul 31, 2009 11:24 am

Middie90 wrote:Yes, UDM is fully funded. I have a friend who is an assistant coach and he said they are already using their 12.6 to "buy" kids that are getting looks from big time schools (i.e. Hopkins, UVA, etc). Is that true? Who knows but you are right, it should be a wake up call for the other schools in the MAAC.


You're sure you want to make that statement? Your asst. friend sounds like he has no idea what he's talking about when he says UDM recruits are getting 'looks' from Hopkins and UVA. Do you or he really believe that?

While I hope your program survives and wins a game(s) in the future, your asst. friend and the rest of the staff would be well advised to watch how Jacksonville is getting started. #1 - Get an established D1 coach. #2 - Get good players from out of state. #3 - see #2.
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Re: Detroit 2010

New postby richlax5 on Fri Jul 31, 2009 6:10 pm

One thing people are truly forgetting is that coaches have a TOTAL of 12.6 to use over four years not every year, i.e. 3.15 x 4 = 12.6 not 12.6 x 4 = 50.4 like football, and I believe it's only tuition dollars not total school cost. We are truly talking an average of 3.15 total scholarship dollars a year giving this years team a total of 6.3 scholarships. The other factor is that if a player comes to the college to play lacrosse and gets money from the school it CAN be counted against this Scholarship total even if it isn't athletic aid. If a student receives funds that he or she does not qualify for but is given anyway and plays a sport it is counted against the scholarship amount.

I have no doubt that UDM can and will be competitive in the MAAC, but I will also say that it is probably on par with Siena, Canisius, St. Joes, MSM, and Marist in terms of the number of scholarships it gives out maybe even one or two behind. The other factor is that it can take time for players to adjust to the college game, especially Division 1. UDM's players may develop into quality players but Siena already has Neufeld and Herbst, Canisius has Jones and LoCocco, and Marist has Zindel and Sharky. These players have shown they can play at the Division 1 level already where as some of the players coming into UDM, aside from some transfers maybe, still have to prove themselves and adjust.
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Re: Detroit 2010

New postby Middie90 on Mon Aug 03, 2009 10:16 pm

richlax5 wrote:One thing people are truly forgetting is that coaches have a TOTAL of 12.6 to use over four years not every year, i.e. 3.15 x 4 = 12.6 not 12.6 x 4 = 50.4 like football, and I believe it's only tuition dollars not total school cost. We are truly talking an average of 3.15 total scholarship dollars a year giving this years team a total of 6.3 scholarships. The other factor is that if a player comes to the college to play lacrosse and gets money from the school it CAN be counted against this Scholarship total even if it isn't athletic aid. If a student receives funds that he or she does not qualify for but is given anyway and plays a sport it is counted against the scholarship amount.

I have no doubt that UDM can and will be competitive in the MAAC, but I will also say that it is probably on par with Siena, Canisius, St. Joes, MSM, and Marist in terms of the number of scholarships it gives out maybe even one or two behind. The other factor is that it can take time for players to adjust to the college game, especially Division 1. UDM's players may develop into quality players but Siena already has Neufeld and Herbst, Canisius has Jones and LoCocco, and Marist has Zindel and Sharky. These players have shown they can play at the Division 1 level already where as some of the players coming into UDM, aside from some transfers maybe, still have to prove themselves and adjust.


From their roster they had 3 grad students (One is now apparently a coach), 4 juniors, and 5 sophomores. They didn't have all freshman last year. Also, they can spend the scholarships in any way they want. Technically they could spend all 12.6 on a single freshman class. Obviously that wouldn't be wise, but they could.

I do know that they invested heavily in transfers last year. They got decent production from them including their top 3 scorers (two of who are returning).

I bet it does thake them 4 years to be truly competitive but I also bet they will win MAAC and OOC games this year.
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Re: Detroit 2010

New postby MILaxGuy on Tue Aug 04, 2009 5:14 pm

You can not go by last year and the scholarships used. I don't believe the coach used to much money on the first class of recruits, he probably used a little pit more on this years. Remember, he coached at Michigan State and they didn't have scholarship money to play with and give to kids. So the coach is probably being very selective on the kids he picks. He It was their first year 30 boys met on the field last August with 3 new coaches and gave it all they had. They played against teams that have been practicing together for 4 years, who understood how the game was to be played at the D1 level. The Coach will divide up the scholarships that he has focusing on a top flight goalie-- which he got from Ohio and then a group of talented boys that will grow together and mesh with the second year players. The can say a lot of things about playing D1 lacrosse and how much you are ready but until you walk on the field it still thinking you can play and now the recruits and last years players will have to step it up. The MAAC teams will not be push overs and they will be focused when they play UDM Titans because no team wants to be the first to lose to them. I agree will they compete in the MAAC and win games outside the MAAC conference but it will be a couple of years before they challenge for the crown. Let's not forget that the majority the the MAAC schools still lie in High School Lacrosse hot beds that even if they don't get a top recruits from the surrounding area, they can get kids that can still play. it will be fun to watch the UDM Titans grow over the next few years.
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Re: Detroit 2010

New postby jimmy_the_crickett on Tue Aug 04, 2009 5:31 pm

tdetriot is a heads for beds program... enough said...
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