Why health care economics is tough

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Re: Why health care economics is tough

New postby TheWalrus on Fri Feb 01, 2013 11:33 pm

cradleandshoot wrote:I feel very stupid on this one 6. I read the link twice and still have no real clear idea what the IRS regulations are saying. Is there any one out there that speaks IRS(outside of Brooklyn) who can interpret this nonsense?


Point is, health insurance now has a floor of $2,400 or less for a family for a year. Don't want insurance? Pay $2,400 a year (much less than the actual cost of insurance) for the privilege of waiting until you get sick. The alternative is our current system, where you don't pay for insurance if you don't want it, then go broke and welch on the hospital and drive everyone else's rates up when you break a bone. One of these makes more sense. At least for those of us who aren't private insurers.

The blog post doesn't give the rule that gives the example context. You'd be similarly confused if I just walked up to you on the street and quoted the price of a Hotel on Boardwalk.
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Re: Why health care economics is tough

New postby LadyLaker on Sat Feb 02, 2013 6:52 am

laxman3221 wrote:
jhu7276 wrote:as far as I'm concerned it would be great to have smoking or using tobacco products ILLEGAL...nothing at all good about this addiction...who's onboard?

:clap:


Not this healthy subject

Image



I had a conversaton with my legal eagle 2 years ago about smokers and smoking-related diseases. I wondered at what point insurance companies would refuse their care b/c they had failed to heed excessive medical warnings on the dangers of smoking.

Further, at what point could doctors have the right (which they do not now) to refuse to treat a patient with no insurance who smokes? When does self-responsbility kick in? You have to be living under a rock not to know the dangers in smoking and, for that matter, obesity.

My own father had a quadruple bypass 2 years before he died. At the hospital, I saw people who'd just had similar operations being wheeled out to a courtyard to have a smoke. I get addiction. I get you'd rather smoke and die than not smoke and live. I am ok with that choice. Then don't have the operation. Just smoke and die.

Bottom Line: Heathcare is a personal responsiblity.

LL

ps - still cracking up about the unions finally figuring out the cost of Obamacare...and now they want federal subsidies to pay for it! :lol: I personally love reading about our collective stupidity in the international papers.
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Re: Why health care economics is tough

New postby cradleandshoot on Sat Feb 02, 2013 10:22 am

TheWalrus wrote:
cradleandshoot wrote:I feel very stupid on this one 6. I read the link twice and still have no real clear idea what the IRS regulations are saying. Is there any one out there that speaks IRS(outside of Brooklyn) who can interpret this nonsense?


Point is, health insurance now has a floor of $2,400 or less for a family for a year. Don't want insurance? Pay $2,400 a year (much less than the actual cost of insurance) for the privilege of waiting until you get sick. The alternative is our current system, where you don't pay for insurance if you don't want it, then go broke and welch on the hospital and drive everyone else's rates up when you break a bone. One of these makes more sense. At least for those of us who aren't private insurers.

The blog post doesn't give the rule that gives the example context. You'd be similarly confused if I just walked up to you on the street and quoted the price of a Hotel on Boardwalk.

You would most likely be correct Walrus. Trying to interpret charts,graphs and tables usually sends my brain into hibernation. I'm not sure I would be confused about the price of a Hotel on Broadway, shocked maybe :o but not confused.
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Re: Why health care economics is tough

New postby laxman3221 on Sat Feb 02, 2013 11:39 am

cradleandshoot wrote:
TheWalrus wrote:
cradleandshoot wrote:I feel very stupid on this one 6. I read the link twice and still have no real clear idea what the IRS regulations are saying. Is there any one out there that speaks IRS(outside of Brooklyn) who can interpret this nonsense?


Point is, health insurance now has a floor of $2,400 or less for a family for a year. Don't want insurance? Pay $2,400 a year (much less than the actual cost of insurance) for the privilege of waiting until you get sick. The alternative is our current system, where you don't pay for insurance if you don't want it, then go broke and welch on the hospital and drive everyone else's rates up when you break a bone. One of these makes more sense. At least for those of us who aren't private insurers.

The blog post doesn't give the rule that gives the example context. You'd be similarly confused if I just walked up to you on the street and quoted the price of a Hotel on Boardwalk.

You would most likely be correct Walrus. Trying to interpret charts,graphs and tables usually sends my brain into hibernation. I'm not sure I would be confused about the price of a Hotel on Broadway, shocked maybe :o but not confused.



So now instead of 85% of the US paying for healthcare, we will have less only paying 2400 a year and this will drive healthcare costs down. :lol: :lol:

Wally,

Tackle this one and how it will drive costs down
I am a neuroradiologist and pain management physician.

Often, we are asked to do more than one scan or procedure in a day.

The new laws state that if we do more than one thing in a day, the second thing must be billed at a severe (>50%) discount.

Therefore...

We are no longer doing more than one thing in a day on any patient. If you need both your cervical (neck) and Lumbar (low back) looked at because you were in an accident and have pain... plan on 2 separate visits from now on. I still have to pay my office staff... you still take the same amount of time in the scanner... my computer still has to run your data... I still have to read it... and I still have the same liability for that read and everything that occurs during your visit.

Now... think about all the times you go to the doctor for a 'cough'... and say... "BTW... my knee really has been hurting lately." He will be glad to say, "Sure... we will look at that when you schedule your next visit."
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Re: Why health care economics is tough

New postby jhu7276 on Sat Feb 02, 2013 9:14 pm

I don't care about the reduction...if a patient needs both procedures I will try to do them both on the same day, particularly as there is always a risk to sedation everytime you do any procedure...another good way to START a patient encounter is to ask what are the 2-3 important questions the patient has during this visit...that way the questions can be answered and you don't run short on time or feel rushed...
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Re: Why health care economics is tough

New postby Paesan33 on Wed Feb 06, 2013 2:23 pm

http://news.investors.com/020513-643239 ... score.aspx

The Congressional Budget Office on Tuesday quietly raised the 10-year cost of ObamaCare's insurance subsidies offered via the health law's exchanges by $233 billion, according to a Congressional Budget Office review of its latest spending forecast.
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Re: Why health care economics is tough

New postby 6ftstick on Thu Feb 07, 2013 8:37 am

Some more of that we don't know whats in the bill till we pass it crapolla

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/02 ... od-labels/

Supermarket owners argue a pending federal food-labeling rule that stems from the new health care law would overburden thousands of grocers and convenience store owners -- to the tune of $1 billion in the first year alone.

The rule stems from an ObamaCare mandate that restaurants provide nutrition information on menus. Most in the restaurant industry were supportive of the idea, but when the FDA decided to extend the provision to also affect thousands of supermarkets and convenience stores, the backlash was swift.

The proposed regulation would require store owners to label prepared, unpackaged foods found in salad bars and food bars, soups and bakery items. Erik Lieberman, regulatory counsel at the Food Marketing Institute, said testing foods for nutritional data will require either expensive software or even more costly off-site laboratory assessments.

"If you get it wrong, it's a federal crime, and you could face jail time and thousands of dollars worth of fines."
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Re: Why health care economics is tough

New postby Spartan22 on Thu Feb 07, 2013 8:57 am

jhu7276 wrote:I don't care about the reduction...if a patient needs both procedures I will try to do them both on the same day, particularly as there is always a risk to sedation everytime you do any procedure...another good way to START a patient encounter is to ask what are the 2-3 important questions the patient has during this visit...that way the questions can be answered and you don't run short on time or feel rushed...


you dont care about the reduction? On top of the already existing limits one can legitimately charge(medicare)? What business degree do you have? Looks like the "rich" doctors are in the site line of our gun shooting commander.
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Re: Why health care economics is tough

New postby jhu7276 on Thu Feb 07, 2013 9:54 am

No one is suggesting doctors work for free, however, there are considerations when what is best for the patient comes first. I didn't go to medical school with the sole purpose "to run a business". It is what it is...I'm telling you communication is what is important and the "art" of medicine has to be balanced by the business of medicine. The Octomom case was an example where a chump Obgyn acquiesced to "demands" for too many eggs which was unsafe for her and for the fetuses. I appreciate you coming to the "support" of doctors, but there aren't enough folks who give a fig ...
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Re: Why health care economics is tough

New postby Spartan22 on Thu Feb 07, 2013 10:01 am

You are welcome. Dr.s are getting squeezed. No patient is denied emergency treatment. Hospitals are getting squeezed. Obama lines up for photos some of the leaders of your profession for support of legislation that negatively impacts your profession, and ultimately your patients. Good luck. to you mds and your patients. My prediction: dire consequences for medicine in our country. Yes, WORSE than it is now...

"Dr, does my HMO cover this?""" you'd be better off bartering for chickens. PS.. Im not an MD but im in the medical field as a professional.. I see it from both sides... provider and consumer...
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Re: Why health care economics is tough

New postby 6ftstick on Thu Feb 07, 2013 2:22 pm

Sarah Palin must be laughin her cute little butt off.

http://redalertpolitics.com/2013/02/07/ ... e-do-this/

“Eventually we do have a problem. That the population is getting older, health care costs are rising… there is this question of how we’re going to pay for the programs. The year 2025, the year 2030, something is going to have to give… … We’re going to need more revenue… Surely it will require some sort of middle class taxes as well… We won’t be able to pay for the kind of government the society will want without some increase in taxes… on the middle class, maybe a value added tax… And we’re also going to have to make decisions about health care, doc pay for health care that has no demonstrated medical benefits. So the snarky version… which I shouldn’t even say because it will get me in trouble is death panels and sales taxes is how we do this.”
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Re: Why health care economics is tough

New postby Paesan33 on Tue Feb 19, 2013 1:02 pm

http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/b2bce37c ... z2LMmdIK1h

US retailers and restaurants chains that employ millions of low-wage workers are considering cutting working hours or paying fines rather than enrolling employees in health insurance plans under Barack Obama’s landmark healthcare law.
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Re: Why health care economics is tough

New postby TheWalrus on Tue Feb 19, 2013 11:26 pm

Link doesn't work, but I'm willing to bet most of those businesses qualify for the tax credits that allow them to provide health insurance for their workers for a fraction of the cost of the penalties. It's a pretty lousy owner who screws his employees out of both working hours and health insurance to essentially get out of doing some paperwork. For context, a small business owner in my state can satisfy the insurance requirement at a whopping cost of $40/month per. Pays for itself in productivity improvements, not to mention that you get to be the employer that actually cares about his employees, instead of the one who cuts their hours for cash (which was the justification for slaving health insurance to employers in the first place)
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Re: Why health care economics is tough

New postby laxman3221 on Wed Feb 20, 2013 7:53 am

TheWalrus wrote:Link doesn't work, but I'm willing to bet most of those businesses qualify for the tax credits that allow them to provide health insurance for their workers for a fraction of the cost of the penalties. It's a pretty lousy owner who screws his employees out of both working hours and health insurance to essentially get out of doing some paperwork. For context, a small business owner in my state can satisfy the insurance requirement at a whopping cost of $40/month per. Pays for itself in productivity improvements, not to mention that you get to be the employer that actually cares about his employees, instead of the one who cuts their hours for cash (which was the justification for slaving health insurance to employers in the first place)


You mean like some state governments are doing to save millions of dollars?
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Re: Why health care economics is tough

New postby TheWalrus on Wed Feb 20, 2013 12:34 pm

The ones forgoing the Medicaid expansion? Sacrificing thousands of lives and billions of federal dollars for ideology. The expansion is funded 100% by the feds for the first three years and 90/10 federal from there on, resulting in a net positive cash flow for states that opt in, via billions in economic growth. States that opt out will continue to see federal Medicaid funding at a rate that is both significantly lower and highly variable depending on in-state economic conditions. It's gross and political, at the expense of our poorest citizens.
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Re: Why health care economics is tough

New postby Paesan33 on Fri Feb 22, 2013 12:17 pm

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/why-yo ... 2013-02-22

Companies have a new solution to rising health-insurance costs: Break up their employees’ marriages.
By denying coverage to spouses, employers not only save the annual premiums, but also the new fees that went into effect as part of the Affordable Care Act. This year, companies have to pay $1 or $2 “per life” covered on their plans, a sum that jumps to $65 in 2014. And health law guidelines proposed recently mandate coverage of employees’ dependent children (up to age 26), but husbands and wives are optional. “The question about whether it’s obligatory to cover the family of the employee is being thought through more than ever before,” says Helen Darling, president of the National Business Group on Health.

Such exclusions barely existed three years ago, but experts expect an increasing number of employers to adopt them: “That’s the next step,” Darling says. HMS, a company that audits plans for employers, estimates that nearly a third of companies might have such policies now. Holdouts say they feel under pressure to follow suit. “We’re the last domino,” says Duke Bennett, mayor of Terre Haute, Ind., which is instituting a spousal carve-out for the city’s health plan, effective July 2013, after nearly all major employers in the area dropped spouses.
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Re: Why health care economics is tough

New postby Brooklyn on Sat Feb 23, 2013 9:48 am

Bottom Line: Heathcare is a personal responsiblity.

LL

ps - still cracking up about the unions finally figuring out the cost of Obamacare...and now they want federal subsidies to pay for it! :lol: I personally love reading about our collective stupidity in the international papers.




So do I. Throughout the world people marvel as to why Americans are so eager to subsidize Israel's health care while neglecting the needs of its own citizens. Europeans well remember the Marshall Plan that enabled them to put universal health care into place. Then they wonder why the government didn't do the same for its own citizens. They are also aware that employees of the big corporations are beneficiaries of subsidized health care (a business expense deducted on the corporate tax form) while employees of small businesses miss out on the same coverage.
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Re: Why health care economics is tough

New postby jhu7276 on Sat Feb 23, 2013 12:35 pm

How about a reference about "the U.S. subsidizing Israel's healthcare"? You continually post about this...what are the actual facts?

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Re: Why health care economics is tough

New postby laxman3221 on Sat Feb 23, 2013 3:56 pm

TheWalrus wrote:The ones forgoing the Medicaid expansion? Sacrificing thousands of lives and billions of federal dollars for ideology. The expansion is funded 100% by the feds for the first three years and 90/10 federal from there on, resulting in a net positive cash flow for states that opt in, via billions in economic growth. States that opt out will continue to see federal Medicaid funding at a rate that is both significantly lower and highly variable depending on in-state economic conditions. It's gross and political, at the expense of our poorest citizens.


No, the one's cutting back workers hours to 29hrs so they don't have to pay for Obamacare.
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Re: Why health care economics is tough

New postby SClaxattack on Sat Feb 23, 2013 4:21 pm

TheWalrus wrote:The ones forgoing the Medicaid expansion? Sacrificing thousands of lives and billions of federal dollars for ideology.


Those aren't federal dollars they aren't spending by opting out. Those are taxpayer's dollars they're saving.
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