NAIA

Men's Collegiate Lacrosse Association

Re: NAIA

New postby LifeLongLaxer85 on Tue Aug 04, 2015 10:09 am

The NAIA was without question positive for MCLA. It gave firm structure to very questionable outposts. (Lindenwood in GRLC, SCAD in the SELC and Davenport). This is the same bad news as it was good due to the fact it will leave holes in the midwest, north and southeast. With the northeast already dominated by ncaa, the MCLA becomes almost exclusively a western league.

That being said, MCLA must not let the NAIA "choose" to come and go. MCLA would be setting itself up to be used and discredited. I am not saying that MCLA should not schedule games with NAIA, but the NAIA should be pushed out now by MCLA; rather than get left in 2-3 years, because that is all we are talking here.
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Re: NAIA

New postby UnConquered on Wed Sep 02, 2015 3:29 pm

LifeLongLaxer85 wrote:The NAIA was without question positive for MCLA. It gave firm structure to very questionable outposts. (Lindenwood in GRLC, SCAD in the SELC and Davenport). This is the same bad news as it was good due to the fact it will leave holes in the midwest, north and southeast. With the northeast already dominated by ncaa, the MCLA becomes almost exclusively a western league.

That being said, MCLA must not let the NAIA "choose" to come and go. MCLA would be setting itself up to be used and discredited. I am not saying that MCLA should not schedule games with NAIA, but the NAIA should be pushed out now by MCLA; rather than get left in 2-3 years, because that is all we are talking here.


I understand where you are coming from, but if you're going to take a strong stance on the NAIA you also must insist teams like Westminster and Palm Beach Atlantic (along with others I'm sure will go varsity) be booted from the MCLA for announcing NCAA D2 status in a couple of years. They shouldn't be allowed to "choose" to come and go correct? I honestly don't have a dog in the fight/race. Just curious why its about the NAIA and not also NCAA teams that also 'used and discredited' the MCLA.
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Re: NAIA

New postby Gecco on Thu Sep 03, 2015 2:48 pm

It is my understanding that nearly all of the southern NAIA schools are not competing in the MCLA this year. Have heard the same about the new conference in Kansas. I believe the Michigan schools are competing in both the NAIA and MCLA this spring. Anyone know for sure who is or is not competing in both the NAIA and MCLA this spring?
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Re: NAIA

New postby umopepisdn on Fri Sep 04, 2015 1:40 pm

Until the new MCLA website launches and schedules are posted, I don't know if we will have a definitive list of who is staying and who is going. I have heard several WHAC(CCLA)/GRLC will remain MCLA and SELC teams took a mass exodus but I don't know for sure.

I have always defended the NAIA programs participating in the MCLA because the MCLA brand views itself not as a club league but as an NCAA alternative, so while it may have been unfair competitively to have varsity teams in the league, it forced "club" programs to step their game up, and for the serious programs it gave a sense of legitimacy because you could be assured that your opponent would be professional in nature.

That all being said, it is time for the NAIA to leave the MCLA now that they have their own governing body, National Invitational, and standards. Teams remaining in the MCLA to chase a championship are only hurting the league because it is preventing teams with a long term vested interest in the league from competing for a national championship. That viewpoint may lower the overall "quality" of teams making the top 16 (specifically in DII) but I would rather have true MCLA programs competing for an MCLA championship.

On the viewpoint of NCAA announcements (PBA, Westy, etc.) I think that is a totally different conversation and you're comparing apples and oranges. The NAIA programs are operating within the realm of the NAIA, and now double dipping with the MCLA. While those programs mentioned are using the MCLA as a spring board to go varsity, they are not currently varsity and their current accolades will not go towards their varsity experience. When they go NCAA they would obviously no longer be allowed to compete. If the MCLA were to eliminate every lacrosse team who had an intention of becoming a varsity program at some point, there would be few teams left.
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Re: NAIA

New postby Hamburg33 on Sat Sep 12, 2015 10:14 am

I currently coach at a midwest NAIA school competing in the the MCLA. Hopefully I can shed some light on what's going on.

For the next two years lacrosse in the NAIA will be an INVITATIONAL sport. So we will have a Championship but it isn't the same as a national championship. These two years are meant to give teams time to adhere to all NAIA rules and regulations, including eligibility and getting recruits in the NAIA clearing house. They will also serve as a two year tryout period to see how many more NAIA teams will go varsity, as the NAIA requires 40 to host a National Championship.

If all goes according to plan after two years ALL NAIA teams will be forced out of the MCLA, as MCLA bylaws only allow teams that are otherwise unable to compete in a national championship. At that point the NAIA will host it's own National Championship.

Sidenote: I know that there is some confusion over NAIA budgets and salaries. I can say that much like D3 or D2 it's all over the board. At this point if we were to bring in a recruiting class of 10, we can only give out between $1500 and $2500 in lacrosse scholarships per player. Also, I can tell you that our head coach does not make a full time money and needs to work another part time job at the school to sustain a livable income. As the assistant I make the same as a Midwest assistant at the D3 level. Not much.

Hopefully that helps clear it up!
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Re: NAIA

New postby JimmyJamz on Tue Sep 15, 2015 6:16 pm

:D :D :D :D
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Re: NAIA

New postby Irish Manifesto on Tue Sep 15, 2015 11:02 pm

What am I missing here? Why would NAIA schools be against going their own way and advancing the sport, their school and their league with their own national championship. In the long run I think this only lends to strengthening all the NAIA schools. I understand where some MCLA teams may see the NAIA schools as being at an advantage because of scholarships but I would think they would prefer them to stick around. It seems their presence has strengthened the MCLA and I would think non scholarship schools would be up for the challenge to face them. What do I know though, I'm just an outsider looking in with no dog in the fight.

Interesting about the scholarship number previously mentioned--that is more than D1 correct? Is the 18.6 a limit set by the NAIA and if not is there/what is the limit?
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Re: NAIA

New postby JimmyJamz on Wed Sep 16, 2015 2:54 pm

:o :? :o
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Re: NAIA

New postby Hamburg33 on Wed Sep 16, 2015 7:58 pm

JimmyJamz wrote:The effort by a few NAIA schools to diminish the value of NAIA Lacrosse is disappointing and shortsighted. Get on board and start acting like a varsity program rather than virtual varsity.


I don't know of any NAIA schools trying to diminish NAIA lacrosse, or treating it as a virtual varsity. I know of NAIA schools waiting the two year waiting period while it's an invitational sport, then hopefully when it is full varsity they will (hopefully) boost funding and scholarships.

JimmyJamz wrote:Our program has 18.6 full scholarship equivalencies for a 45 man roster and a full-time coaching staff with benefits.


That's awesome for you guys! Hopefully we can all get there soon!
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Re: NAIA

New postby Tlax27 on Thu Sep 17, 2015 2:41 am

Moving the NAIA out of the MCLA is a great thing for lacrosse. However, I am not trying to bash on the MCLA I think its great to give a chance to the players at schools to keep playing lacrosse while in college. If that's what the goal is for the MLCA then the leadership needs to be more proactive towards having a positive look on the MCLA rather then just fit in and blend in with the "team"....

I think its a great thing that the NAIA is trying to have a push for lacrosse. With some NAIA schools, there are plenty of opportunities from academic to athletic scholarships to advance players to picking schools over MCLA and even NCAA.

As far as the pay scale for coaches in the NAIA, I have heard from a few coaches that I know, they are getting paid more then NCAA D2, D3 and even some smaller D1. So I think its a great thing when teams pick or "choose" to make the transition from the MCLA to NAIA. It shows the growth in the sport as well as professionalism between governing bodies.
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Re: NAIA

New postby laxdadwest on Thu Sep 17, 2015 9:10 pm

I think that the NAIA starting lacrosse is a great thing also, however, I don't think it hurts the MCLA that much. The teams that are leaving weren't that competitive anyhow. In D2, Missouri Valley is the only decent team, and that's only because they had a potential POY player come in. The best teams are still in the CCLA and division with ST Thomas, St Johns, and N Dak St. D1 ASU GCU COL CSU and Chapman. No NAIA schools among them. So, I think that the NAIA has some catching up to do with the MCLA, Scholarships and all. But, It is always nice to see lax grow across the country.
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Re: NAIA

New postby almostbaldeagle on Fri Sep 18, 2015 8:22 am

laxdadwest wrote:I think that the NAIA starting lacrosse is a great thing also, however, I don't think it hurts the MCLA that much. The teams that are leaving weren't that competitive anyhow. In D2, Missouri Valley is the only decent team, and that's only because they had a potential POY player come in. The best teams are still in the CCLA and division with ST Thomas, St Johns, and N Dak St. D1 ASU GCU COL CSU and Chapman. No NAIA schools among them. So, I think that the NAIA has some catching up to do with the MCLA, Scholarships and all. But, It is always nice to see lax grow across the country.


There are a few NAIA teams that were pretty competitive and were regulars at the MCLA National Tourney: Davenport, SCAD, Westminster (moving to NCAA DII), Indiana Tech, Missouri Valley (as you mentioned).

I think if Davenport plays in the NAIA invitational tournament this year they would be the clear favorites to take home the first crown.
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Re: NAIA

New postby umopepisdn on Sat Jan 02, 2016 5:42 pm

Hamburg33 wrote:If all goes according to plan after two years ALL NAIA teams will be forced out of the MCLA, as MCLA bylaws only allow teams that are otherwise unable to compete in a national championship. At that point the NAIA will host it's own National Championship.



Wanted to point out that the Bylaws actually say non-ncaa, nothing about "allowing teams that are otherwise unable to compete in national championships" unless it was very recently changed. Hence why a bunch of the NAIA schools remain in the MCLA this year.

Also, someone said the NAIA teams in MCLA weren't competitive. If you'll notice, all of the better teams, and many of the consistently nationally ranked teams (Indy Tech, Siena Heights, SCAD, MVC, LTU, Davenport, St Gregory's, Aquinas, St Andrew's, Reinhardt, MoBap, LUB, Lourdes) remained. Of those teams I just listed, 10 of them were in the top 25 at some point in 2015, so NAIA will be plenty competitive. Only a few teams, (Montreat, Asbury, etc.) either left MCLA (why pay the fees if you have a governing body and are building a team) or just never joined (Ottawa, Cumberlands, etc.)
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NAIA on the rise

New postby Tlax27 on Thu Jan 28, 2016 12:06 pm

Looks like Lacrosse in the NAIA is making some moves with tournament location. Great growth for the game!

http://www.naia.org/ViewArticle.dbml?DB ... =210669991
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Re: NAIA

New postby southernlax on Fri Jan 29, 2016 10:31 pm

Tlax27 wrote:Looks like Lacrosse in the NAIA is making some moves with tournament location. Great growth for the game!

http://www.naia.org/ViewArticle.dbml?DB ... =210669991

Is it? The MCLA moved on after two miserable years there. Great town and city and folks.. but not for a lacrosse national championship. The stadium is archaic. the field awful.

Looking from the outside but with some great contacts in he NAIA.. it is the bottom dwellers leading this charge. The MCLA is a great spot for the NAIA teams. at least the competitive ones. Let’s all wait 5 years and see where things are. The NAIA is spread out nationwide. The costs for travel will be awful considering competitive MCLA teams are around the corner for most of these teams, not so much for NAIA. A very short sited move. The MCLA will make the NAIA teams choose one or the other sooner rather than later.

I do wish them all the best, but there is a HUGE difference between the rich and the poor in the NAIA. Good luck
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Re: NAIA

New postby Gecco on Sat Jan 30, 2016 12:52 am

southernlax wrote:
Tlax27 wrote:Looks like Lacrosse in the NAIA is making some moves with tournament location. Great growth for the game!

http://www.naia.org/ViewArticle.dbml?DB ... =210669991

Is it? The MCLA moved on after two miserable years there. Great town and city and folks.. but not for a lacrosse national championship. The stadium is archaic. the field awful.

Looking from the outside but with some great contacts in he NAIA.. it is the bottom dwellers leading this charge. The MCLA is a great spot for the NAIA teams. at least the competitive ones. Let’s all wait 5 years and see where things are. The NAIA is spread out nationwide. The costs for travel will be awful considering competitive MCLA teams are around the corner for most of these teams, not so much for NAIA. A very short sited move. The MCLA will make the NAIA teams choose one or the other sooner rather than later.

I do wish them all the best, but there is a HUGE difference between the rich and the poor in the NAIA. Good luck


Who are these so called bottom dwellers?
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Re: NAIA

New postby Sassy1 on Mon Feb 01, 2016 2:20 pm

Not sure about the "bottom dwellers" but I am wondering what some of the top NAIA teams will do. Will they try and compete in both tournaments if they make it. Seems almost impossible to travel to S.C. and then to travel to Cali. Any idea on what teams are competing in the NAIA this year? Seems like the MCLA would want to push the NAIA teams out as they now have a National Tournament to attend. Any thoughts? Does anyone care?
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Re: NAIA

New postby almostbaldeagle on Mon Feb 01, 2016 2:38 pm

I feel as if Davenport probably has the most to lose by playing in the NAIA tourney. They are routinely in the MCLA D1 national tournament which is far more competitive than the NAIA tourney will be.
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Re: NAIA

New postby umnlaxcoach on Mon Feb 01, 2016 3:30 pm

2016 is Davenport's third or fourth season in MCLA D1. Prior to that they were regular participants in the MCLA D2 tourney.
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Re: NAIA

New postby Gecco on Tue Feb 02, 2016 11:13 pm

The first NAIA national poll is out.

http://www.naia.org/ViewArticle.dbml?SP ... M_ID=27900

NAIA Men’s Lacrosse Coaches’ Top 10 Poll – Preseason (Feb. 2)
Rank School Final Points
1 Davenport (Mich.) (7) 119
2 Missouri Valley (1) 113
3 Siena Heights (Mich.) 103
4 Reinhardt (Ga.) 94
5 Indiana Tech 82
6 Missouri Baptist 74
7 St. Andrews (NC) 71
8 Lindenwood-Belleville (Ill.) 58
9 SCAD Savannah (Ga.) 53
10 Lourdes (Mich.) 45

Others receiving votes: Aquinas (Mich.) 32; Tennessee Wesleyan 29; Ottawa (Kan.) 28; St. Mary’s (Kan.) 16; Michigan-Dearborn 15; Lawrence Tech (Mich.) 11; Robert Morris (Ill.) 7; Asbury (Ky.) 6; St. Ambrose (Iowa) 5; St. Gregory’s (Okla.) 2.
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